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Post Info TOPIC: Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage


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RE: Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage
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All things on the FFR forum state the headers will fit into the space easily... it's getting the bolts in that's the cuss session.

You have to get your head wrapped around the idea that the collectors are forward on one of these... bassakwards from everything we're used to. 
We'll see!



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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John D wrote:

All things on the FFR forum state the headers will fit into the space easily... it's getting the bolts in that's the cuss session.

You have to get your head wrapped around the idea that the collectors are forward on one of these... bassakwards from everything we're used to. 
We'll see!


 OK, that makes sense with the sidepipes. It still may help to lift the engine an inch or so, to get your hand in there for the bolts.



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Mitch D.   River Falls, WI

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1970 Chevelle SS 396 M20



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Just spent a few hours surfing around sourcing out some coolant hoses/lines.
I'm going to stray from the FFR provided overflow/puke tank, cheesy stainless radiator flex-hose, and do what many others have done - use a Mustang puke/overflow tank, and molded hoses for the coolant. The FFR stuff will work, provide a stable system, and you're on the road... but it starts looking like a "kit car" - not like something meant to be there.

Other guys on the FFR forum have already done the legwork on this, and a 2012 F-150 upper hose works, and a 1998 Dodge Ram1500 works for the lower (both with mods, but damn close.
The part that frosts my nuggets is being held hostage to "Ford Only" parts - the hoses for the reservoir/puke tank.

The Coyote is fitted with "Quick Connect" fittings, and oddly placed hose barb nipples for this. A regular piece of hose and a clamp will work, but looks cobbled. Enter the XYZ123-784698Y available from Ford only molded hoses. My engine supplier provided the tank, but not the hoses. $125+ later the hoses are on the way from Tasca Ford Parts.

Rock Auto, NAPA, Advance, name it has no source for these. It's Ford.... The fitment charts state they fit multiple cars & engine combos, but no aftermarket yet. Argg...

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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Anyone can do the aftermarket chrome and glitter, to make it look like it came from the factory is not always the easy way but usually look much better.

Nice job thumbsup



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Bob W.

Lino Lakes



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John-

Let me know next time on the OEM parts. If you have a number, and are positive that's what you need, I can see what price I can do for you from one of my wholesale Ford suppliers.

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1972 Malibu
Vaguely stock appearing, and the opposite of restored.
1999 std bore 5.7, Vortec heads, Holley Stealth Ram, GM cam
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(I also post to the FFR discussion forum, usually with more detail than here (over there, there are guys building these things). Rather than re-write everything, I cut n pasted my text on here.)

12/29 Update 1 of 3


I’ll always give credit where it’s due… my mounting system was inspired by the unit(s) offered by Breeze Automotive.
Upper Mount kit
Lower Mount kit
I’m also using the Breeze radiator shroud, and incorporating its mounting with the radiator.

Materials:
3’ section of piano hinge
3’ stick of ½” aluminum “U” channel
3’ stick of 5/16” “All-Thread” rod
2) 1-1/2” x 3” x 1/8” aluminum flat/strip stock
10-32 “NutSerts”
5/16”, 8-32, and 10-32 fasteners as needed
Rattle-can Primer & Paint of your choice

Upper Mount Tips & Pointers:
The small ¾” tubes welded to the upper crossbar of the frame need to be removed.
I used a Dremel type tool with a cut-off wheel to cut the welds, and big channel locks to pry the pieces off.
An angle grinder was used to clean up the rest of the weld beads.
The piano hinge was cut to fit the radiator flange, taking into account using the factory holes, and aligning them to the FFR suggested 5/8” offset.
The 4 mounting points on the upper cross tube are 10-32 “NutSerts”
The 6 mounting points on the radiator flange are 8-32 screws, with serrated flange nuts.
The mounting points for the upper end of the shroud (not in photo) were drilled 3/16”. 8-32 screws, with serrated flange nuts are used to mount the shroud.
Measure twice, cut once.



Lower Mount Tips & Pointers:
The “U” channel was clamped to the frame member and marked/cut for an exact fit to the outside of the ¾” frame tubes.
The elliptical hanger(s) lower holes are slots, for adjustment.
The radiator location is offset to the DS by 5/8”, as recommended by FFR
The shroud, radiator flange, and “U” channel were jigged up, and mounting holes drilled through all three for 8-32 threads, then disassembled.
The shroud & flange holes were opened up to 3/16” to allow for an 8-32 screw.
The “U” channel was tapped to 8-32, and machine screws used to mount the shroud to the “U”, sandwiching the flange.
Final length of the “all-thread” rod was determined after jigging up the assembly.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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12/29 Update 2 of 3

I chose to not use the FFR supplied SS flex hose for the radiator connections. I prefer the look of the molded rubber hoses, and a simple straight pipe section. #9365 is running a Coyote 5.0, and was shipped with the “newer” radiator that has an angled inlet and outlet.


Parts Used:
Upper Hose - (Shipped with Ford Performance Controls Pack)
Motorcraft # KM 5290
Ford # FR3Z-8260-C
Lower Hose - This will be made up from two molded hoses, with an elbow tube to connect them.

Engine end: (fitment is for a 1994 to 2001 Dodge Ram 1500/2500/3500 w/ V8)
NAPA # 8726
Dayco # 71713
Radiator end - (Shipped with Ford Performance Controls Pack):
Ford # BR33-8286-BA
Motorcraft # KM5136
(These numbers do not want to cross-over to any aftermarket vendor, Gates/NAPA/Dayco, etc.)
Connector Pipe:
What’s needed is a 1-1/2” O.D., 90deg bend, with at least one of the straight legs 12” long. The other leg can be as short as 2” long. You can get creative, or…
Jegs # 679-MB1040

(I’ll tag a disclaimer on here as it’s up to you to determine the fitment & parts will work, and assume you’ll be offsetting the radiator the FFR recommended 5/8” to the Driver’s Side)

Upper Hose:
No modification needed. The supplied hose is nearly a perfect fit – if it was ½” longer it would be perfect. A little stretch and it works.
Lower Hose Engine End:
I can’t stress the old rule of “Measure Twice, Cut Once”…
Fit the hose on the engine nipple, and mark where it intersects the frame member.
In my instance it wound up being about 7” down from the inside of the molded 90. (near a slight kink in the straight section). Cut here.

Lower Hose Radiator End:
The hose works when installed backwards.
Trim off about 1” from the end marked “ENG”.
From the “ENG” end, at the last bit of straight section (towards the end marked “RAD”), cut off the remainder.
Fit the hose on the radiator nipple.
Connector Pipe:
Jig up/fit the pipe and measure where the hoses end. Mark the hard pipe.
- Allow for at least 1” engagement into the rubber hoses. More is better.
- Cut the hard pipe
- Test fit


Attachment to the frame member(s) is up to you. There’s a myriad of clamps or brackets, or make your own.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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12-29 Update 3 of 3

While waiting for the paint to dry on the radiator mounting pieces, I tackled a few “odd n ends” in the engine compartment.

Fuel System:
I’m not using the supplied FFR regulator assembly. My engine kit from Forte’s included the GM bypass/regulator fuel filter system. The supplied 3/8” pressure line made it to the center of the firewall. I needed a way to get it to the engine fuel rail.
Parts:
Summit SUM-221330B (3/8”M quick connect to AN-6)
Russell 640730 (3/8”M quick connect to 3/8”F quick connect w/ 1/8” NPT port)
FFR Coyote Install kit
30” 3/8” quick connect to AN-6 braided hose
Fuel Pressure gauge
- I disassembled one end of the hose assembly and shortened it about 6”.
- Using some Teflon tape, thread the pressure gauge into the fuel rail port.
- Snap on the quick connect fittings and it’s done.


Brake/Clutch Reservoir:
I reworked my original mounting bracket for the Tilton 3-chamber reservoir. It was too high, and didn’t have any offset for the hood prop strut to fold into.


Engine Vacuum & PCV:
I got a fitting kit from JLT Performance. It includes the needed quick-connects for the cam vacuum solenoids and the Driver’s side PCV hose.
Using a Uni-bit, I drilled a hole in the Spectre intake elbow, installed the grommet with some sealant, and connected the hose with the quick-connect adapter.


For the vacuum solenoids, a 3/8” quick connect to hose barb fitting (JLT) was used at the stub-end near the intake inlet, a 3/8”- 3/8” hose barb 90 (JLT), and a ½” to 3/8” 90deg. hose barb fitting (hardware store) at the port behind the throttle body.


As I was writing this up, my full-bypass heater control valve showed up… more to come.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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As much as it is nice for a quick visual on the fuel pressure, the downside is if that pressure gauge ever leaks, it will be catastrophic and cause a potentially deadly fire. Replace it with a Schroeder valve or pressure transducer. If you suspect fuel pressure issues, you can check it as diagnostic. You have done such a great effort, and way too nice for that risk versus reward.

Keep up the great work. Look forward to seeing it completed.

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John E - Rogers, MN

Instructions? All I need is the exploded view.
70 El Camino soon to be ls1/t56
64 Malibu SS



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I've thought about that very thing, but give this a whirl around the synapses...

Between everything good/safe & disaster, there's about a dozen of these "quick-connect/push-lock" connectors dealing with 55+psi of gasoline - with nothing but an O-ring and a piece of plastic mechanism locking them together and sealing it from mayhem...

Such is the modern automotive world.

The gauge is probably the most secure, mechanical assembly in the system! Everything else is plastic & O-ring.




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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage - Heater Plumbing pt.1
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Update 12/30

Sheryl went to do some damage at "Mall of America" with a friend, and left me to my own devices this afternoon... so more time in the "40 Watt".

Full Bypass Heater Control Valve

Running a Coyote with a heater requires the use of a “full bypass” heater control valve.
The coolant flow (through the heater on a Coyote-equipped Ford vehicle) includes a crossover path from cylinder head to cylinder head in its design, and this is why when installing this engine without a heater, they require a “crossover” hose be installed on the ports from head to head.
A typical heater control valve just shuts off the coolant flow through the heater core – deadheading the coolant flow from supply to return. Not good – eliminates the “crossover” needed by the Coyote.
Living in MN with a “thermally challenged” spouse required a heater be installed in #9365. This will detail what I came up with to supply the heater kit.

Parts:

1) Old Air Products 25-1018 “pull to open” bypass valve
5ft. 5/8” generic heater hose
2) 5/8” molded 90deg heater bypass hoses
NAPA NBH9807
Dayco 80400

8) Gates “Powergrip” heat-shrink hose clamps
NAPA NBH42925

The two 5/8” quick connects from the Controls Pack
Some scrap aluminum sheet, misc hardware.

I wanted everything to be tucked up nice & neat under the engine cover.
The supplied aluminum elbows in the FFR/Vintage Air heater kit somewhat influenced my choice on mounting, as well as the length & bend radius of the control cable. The corner of the PS valve cover just worked.

With the aluminum 90’s in place, and the control valve laying kinda where it needs to go, I got a visual on how much to trim off the hoses and the tubes. Measure twice, cut once. There’s a lot of “fudge” room here for trimming, so be generous on your initial measurements.
Using a tubing cutter I trimmed off the ends of the aluminum tubes & deburred them. I wanted a way to put some kind of “bell” on the end, but my flare tool wouldn’t go big enough. I found a socket with a nice flare to it, put it in the end of the tube, and gave it a few smacks with a hammer. The soft aluminum “bell’d out” just nice, and gave a lip for the hose to seal on.

Heater09.png

A little playing around/trimming with the hose elbows got the control valve laying where it needed to be.

Heater10.png

Heater11.png



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage
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Next was fitting the supply/return hoses. Working with the natural curve/set of the hose, I marked and cut to fit the supply/return hoses. (the shrink clamps are not set). The ty-raps are to hold the hoses in relative location.

Heater12.png

Heater13.png

This is what I was after… nice clean install

Heater14.png

Heater15.png

I made up a mounting bracket from some scrap, and attached it to one of the unused studs on the intake. It locks the hoses in position, and in combination with the aluminum elbows the control valve doesn’t move during actuation, but has some “give” for engine movement.

 Heater16.png

Heater17.png

Heater18.png

Heater19.png



-- Edited by John D on Monday 31st of December 2018 04:19:30 PM

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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Why do i think you’re going to be waiting for the snow to melt so you can drive this thing. Very nice work going on in the 40W garage.

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Northwestern Ohio



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12/31 – Exhaust Headers

I was expecting to use up all the cuss words I didn’t vent while installing the engine while doing this… but in all honesty not one naughty word was muttered! This was by far the easiest header install I’ve done in a long time. Not knowing what was in store for me stuffing the Coyote into that little engine bay, I removed all 16 exhaust manifold studs. I didn’t want them getting in the way & snagging on things. In hindsight, they’re tucked well under the head(s), and other “stuff” sticks out farther – they wouldn’t have been an issue – but having them out had its benefits while installing the headers. No lost time, 6 to one, ½ dozen to another.

These are the FFR stainless headers. I’m very impressed by the build/weld quality… save one little thing on one side... Inside the collector on one side there was a chunk of MIG wire stuck near the O2 bung. No big deal, and nothing 2 seconds with a sanding drum on the die grinder didn’t fix.

Headers_01.png

Headers_02.png 

Hardware:

The Coyote comes from Ford with one manifold installed, and studs for the other side. From the git-go you’re short 8 nuts… and the Ford nuts are the diabolical crunched/crimped self lockers.

FFR supplies 16) 10 x 25mm bolts… no washers... ?

I did save the Ford nuts, but also got 16) 10mm serrated flange nuts, and 16) 10 x 30mm flange-head bolts. This way I could mix-n-match as the situation called.

Passenger side:

Super easy install. I used the Ford studs on every location except the center two. Clearance for a wrench or socket meant going with a flange-head bolt.

Headers_03.png

Headers_04.png 

Driver’s Side:

This side is a bit tough. Clearances are really tight, but the header does slide in there, however it won’t go in with the full-length Ford studs in place. (This is where removing them was a benefit)

Once in there I got under the car, and determined that the rearmost 3 locations would be better served with studs – trying to get a 25 to 30 mm bolt started and run down would be a pain. The other 5 locations I used the flange-head bolts. I had to cut the Ford studs down approx. ¾” to get clearance to slide the header in (did I say this side was tight?). This left about 3 full threads exposed with the stud installed and the nut run down against the header flange.

Headers_08.png 

With the exception of the forward 3 locations, every other is a PITA to tighten… there’s room for a full-length wrench in there, but several are 1/16th of a turn for the whole run.

Headers_07.png

The finished job...

Headers_10.png

Headers_11.png



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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Nice work.

Are you planning a heat shields for where the headers jute out in front of the the foot compartment? Radiant heat soak from the headers could make your feet toasty after a while.

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John E - Rogers, MN

Instructions? All I need is the exploded view.
70 El Camino soon to be ls1/t56
64 Malibu SS



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Yup... "heat management" is a big problem with these cars - especially the driver's footbox. They've made it as big as possible for the pedals & footroom, but it gets very close to the pipes.

Still deciding on which brand of stuff... Dynamat, Thermo-Tec, there's a bunch.

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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No cuss words installing the headers couldn't have been much fun...laughing

I think what John meant, was a shield spaced 3/16 from the foot well panel to block the heat from getting directly at the inner panel. That sort of shielding goes a long way toward reducing the temp of the panel behind it. Sort of acts like a heat sink. Another layer of adhesive heat blocker inside would stand a much better chance of staying on a vertical surface too.

I notice the tires don't have many "imaginary miles" on them. Are you spending enough time in the cockpit, steering and gearing ...razz



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Mitch D.   River Falls, WI

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Some Assembly Required

1966 Chevelle SS 396 M20

1970 Chevelle SS 396 M20



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A heat shield (w/ air-gap) is possible on the passenger side, but not the driver's. The DS clearance is between 1/8" & 1/4".

If you look at the PS compared to DS in the pictures... you can see the 2" round frame member for the bottom of the footbox is exposed, and the tin goes inside of it? On the DS the tin is on the outside of the tube. Also the offset of the cylinder heads works against the driver's side - the left bank is by design is farther aft than the PS.

Many builders install fresh air ducting into the footboxes. Instead of running flex hose from the grille openings to the front brakes (like original), they'll route it into the footboxes. I'm still on the fence about this one.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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My "Ford Only" coolant reservoir/puke tank hoses showed up today. Spent a few hours getting them cut to fit and coming up with a couple of brackets to mount the "turtle" under the hood.
(While waiting for the hoses, I cleaned up, prepped & painted the hood hinges. Project creep again - needed the hinges in place to determine final location of the tank.)

Got everything mounted and hooked up, and now have 3 gallons of orange Kool-Aid 50/50 mix in the system, with another gallon on standby.

Reservoir01.png

Reservoir03.png

Reservoir07.png

Put a little over 2 gallons of fuel in the tank as well. Flipped the key on and the gauge now reads 1/8-tank, so I know the gauge & sender works. Also heard the fuel pump kick on and watched the fuel pressure gauge move up. Several more cycles of on/off and the fuel pressure at the engine/fuel rail is at 58psi. and has been holding for over two hours. (no leaks!)

There's 8 quarts of oil in the sump... It's really looking like we're gonna have the monumental "First Start" very soon!!



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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After double-checking everything, fluids, clamps, bolts, whatever... it came down to "sh*t or get off the pot" - turn the key to "Start" and see what happens.
Sheryl & I had dinner, went out to the 40 Watt and clicked the "record" button.

IT'S ALIVE!!!
This is a no BS as happened video. Other than switching the key on/off a few times earlier to "prime" the fuel system, this is an absolutely genuine 1st start of a brand-new build.

This is really a testament as to how well FFR has engineered this kit, and produced something that can be bolted together into a running vehicle. Granted, some mechanical aptitude and machinery "horse sense" really speeds things along, but it can be done. From delivery to now is 186 days.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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Congratulations !!

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Mitch D.   River Falls, WI

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Some Assembly Required

1966 Chevelle SS 396 M20

1970 Chevelle SS 396 M20



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John as I posted on facebook like Scott P....Impressed, but not surprised.  Your engineering and quality of work are always top notch.  It is always a great feeling on that first successful engine start.  tiphat

As Kevin would say...'Now you're running on ship's power!'  



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Stan S.-Twin Cities Northland

1971 Heavy Chevy Tribute 350 c.i./TH350

1997 Pontiac Trans Am LT1/6 Speed Manual

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Very nice. I except you will firing it up today for giggles also.  

Love the sound when you blipped the throttle.   When you first open it up on the street, remember counter steer into the slide.  nana



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John E - Rogers, MN

Instructions? All I need is the exploded view.
70 El Camino soon to be ls1/t56
64 Malibu SS



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Beautiful! Looks good, sounds good. I love that experience of the first start.

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Larry L.

Coon Rapids



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great work!

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Bruce L. - Lakeville MN

1971 Malibu Convert

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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage - Cubby Details
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In previous posts I detailed the upholstery of the rear cockpit wall, and the fabrication of the sliding doors for the "cubby hole".

In the months since then, I've been on the search for a set of handles/knobs/whatever for the slider doors. Whenever I was in a hardware store or home center I'd peruse the kitchen sections looking. The search paid off.

I found some handles that closely match the look of my passenger-side grab bar. I want to maintain a "theme" throughout the interior... not a lot of "bling", but just some brightwork where it needs to be - that ties everything together.
CubbyTrim04.png

CubbyTrim05.png

CubbyTrim06.png

I didn't want to screw this up (or foul the upholstery on the doors!). I set the handles in place on the doors and got a "that looks good" measurement for where they needed to be. I transferred those measurements to a piece of scrap and made a drilling template.

CubbyTrim07.png

CubbyTrim08.png

After cutting the supplied screws to size, there's now handles on the cubby-hole doors.

CubbyTrim09.png

CubbyTrim10.png



-- Edited by John D on Saturday 12th of January 2019 02:04:49 PM

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Another item that's been on the "nagging at me/back burner" was the openings for the shoulder harnesses.
Seeing as I upholstered the upper 1/2 of the wall in pleather, I knew that it would not hold up for long with the belts dragging across it.

I've seen offerings of "grommets" for the openings, but that really didn't solve the problem of the drag of the belts across the opening. I've been kicking this around in my head for awhile.

There was this 3" stainless band-clamp in the scrapbox that was calling to me. I took some measurements and found that I could get the 4 pieces I needed out of it.

CubbyTrim11.png

CubbyTrim12.png

They were rough-cut to size, mounting holes drilled, and riveted into a stack. When all together they were shaped to size - 4 identical pieces. After experimenting with the bend angle on one, they were bent to the same angle...

CubbyTrim13.png

CubbyTrim14.png

CubbyTrim15.png


Mounting holes were drilled, and (after a session on the rag-wheel & polish) they were riveted in place
CubbyTrim16.png

CubbyTrim17.png

CubbyTrim18.png

CubbyTrim19.png



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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RE: Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage
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Looking good John!

 

It's going to be so nice you'll need to come up with your crazy "I don't want to sell it" asking price for when the inevitable offers get thrown your way!  razz

 



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'71 Malibu



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Back to the passenger 'Oh Sh*t!' handle/grab bar, I have a feeling that's going to get a lot of use when Sheryl is riding along!  hyperthumbsup



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Stan S.-Twin Cities Northland

1971 Heavy Chevy Tribute 350 c.i./TH350

1997 Pontiac Trans Am LT1/6 Speed Manual

Forum influenced terms: 'Link Paste', 'Stanitized', & 'Revolving garage door...' 

 



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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage - Wheel Alignment
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Back to that "Tales of a Toolbox" write-up I did awhile ago...
Dug around in Dads box and pulled out his (now "vintage") J.H. Bender model 400 magnetic camber/caster gauge. I'm guessing he bought this in the mid 50's, before the true alignment racks became the norm in the shops. It's still in great shape, a few combat scars, but the vials and bubbles are intact which is all that matters. This was designed to stick onto the machined surface of the bearing hub, over the dust cap.
014.jpg
That's not possible with the Roadster. The hub is buried in the wheel, and the wheel is aluminum. Had to come up with a way to mount the tool.

I used 2 lengths of of 1 x 1 aluminum angle, with a piece of 3/16 mild-steel plate in the center. The angle is cut to fit inside the outer lip of the wheel, bearing on the "bead" surface. It's held in place with velcro strapping (the stuff voice/data guys use to bundle cables).
A length of mason's string is stretched (between two jackstands), and set parallel to the frame. I don't have "lazy Susan" plates, so I taped a protractor to the rig at the center point. (This is to verify the wheels are turned to the recommended 20 deg's (L & R, 40* total) during adjustment). The tires are sitting on a couple of layers of heavy poly sheet for slipperyness during turning.
012.jpg

013.jpg


Setting up a front suspension from raw "parts in a box" is an exercise in frustration... especially with fully adjustable arms! (Nothing's designed in for a particular car, they fit anything)
FFR supplies some rough center to center measurements for the Upper Control Arms (UCA) to get you in the ballpark, but the front end is still really wonky.

To time-compress about 10 hours work, here's the procedure:

- Devise a way to easily lock/hold and release the steering wheel in the centered position
- Center the steering rack. Full Left, Full Right, split the difference, lock the steering wheel down. (This also confirmed my initial assembly when the steering shaft was mounted to the rack. The steering wheel was dead-nuts centered at the middle of the rack travel) 
- Set a rough toe-in adjustment. (This was nothing more than two tape measures, as close to wheel center as obstructions allow, to repeatable reference points on the front and rear of the tires) Turn each side equally in or out!

Release the steering wheel
- Set a rough camber adjustment for one side (Crank the UCA sleeves equally in or out as needed).
- Set a rough caster adjustment on this side (Crank the UCA sleeves as needed, not looking for final numbers, but close).
Get a good metal machinist ruler, and measure the exposed threads, center to centers, etc. on this side.
Adjust the opposite side to these rough measurements.

The thing to keep in mind is that every adjustment interacts with another... and this early in the game they REALLY mess with each other. Repeat the above steps about 38 times... you will be covering the same ground many times. (Remember to lock the steering wheel when setting Toe.)

Once I got the passenger side dialed in pretty close with the gauge, I moved it to the driver's side, and got it dialed in to the same "close" numbers as the PS (again, the above about 26 times)

Now I've got a car whose wheels are pointed in the right directions, the UCA's look pretty much "mirror images" of each other, and now you're chasing fractions of a degree settings.
Sanity Tip:
At this stage you'll be turning the adjuster sleeves fractions of a turn, and you need to keep track of how many turns.
On the tie-rod extensions I put a blue Sharpie mark on a flat, and a red mark on the opposite/180 side flat.
On the UCA sleeves tape was put on a flat.

Now that things are close:
- Pick a side, and adjust for Caster first. Get it on the nutz.
- Adjust this side for Camber **Use your marks** Adjust each sleeve equally in or out as needed, count flats or peaks - you want to tilt the whole assembly, not change the Caster.
- Run the steering lock to lock a few times, and bounce the suspension.

- Center the steering

- Move to the other side and adjust for Caster, then Camber.

- Run the steering lock to lock a few times, and bounce the suspension.

-Center the Steering


- Set Toe-In **Use your marks** Adjust each side equally in or out as needed, count flats or peaks
- Re-check Caster & Camber on each side. Tweak if needed.
- Re-check Toe. Tweak if needed.
- Once #9365 is on the road, I'll correct any steering wheel centering issues with a turn or two on the tie-rods.

FFR Recommended Suspension settings are:

Caster +7*, Camber -.5*, Toe-In 1/16"

diditmyself.jpg



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage
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I believe it would be best to have it all gone over on a laser alignment rack, to be certain it's optimal.

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Some Assembly Required

1966 Chevelle SS 396 M20

1970 Chevelle SS 396 M20



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Yup... I'll wait until a trusted shop has one of those "Free Alignment Checks" specials and drop this bomb on them!! laughing



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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I strongly recommend Jeff "The Alignment Guy" Forss. He's the guy that all the local racers use, he is not afraid to do custom stuff, he does a lot of high end cars, and his prices are reasonable.

www.thealignmentguy.com

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Derek Kiefer - Mantorville, MN

69 Malibu Pro-Touring stroker LS1-383/T56 - 69 SS396-325/3spd project



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Well, between work travel & Ma Nature's tantrums, there's been no real progress on #9365.

I've been nudged to host a bench racing session sometime soon - non-official NCC get together. I may do that in the next few weeks. I'm in CO. next week, then I'll be in Alabama for 3 weeks of March, and I'd like to get the body down from the rafters and on the car for a test-fitting.
Getting it off was easy, nothing in the way and nothing to potentially mess up. Now's a different story.

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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If you are interested in seeing the roadster, please go to Forum>Members Only>We’re Going to This – Want to Come Along>Factory Five Roadster Build – 40 Watt Garage for details.

 



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Hankster

Columbus, MN

'71 Chevelle SS frame-off, restro-mod, 402/375hp, Tremec TKO 600 5-speed, 3:90 12-bolt posi

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Banged out the Decatur AL plant migration a full week ahead of schedule - including punchlist items - so I don't have to go back for the 3rd week!
(It is a huge help to me that the plant's security director has "taken ownership" of the system, and tries to keep it in tip-top condition)

Not much to report. After clearing my "honey do" list Saturday I was able to get out in the garage for a few hours.

Managed to get the front wiring harness (headlights, signals, and horn) permanently mounted with ty-rap clips, etc., and the horns jigged up & mounted.



-- Edited by John D on Sunday 31st of March 2019 05:22:00 AM

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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A very cool video/interview of a 3-time FFR builder.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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The last couple of days has been spent fitting the lamp housings, fuel filler, and then prepping & coating the underside of the body.

I had FFR cut the body openings. I think it was money well spent, they did a nice job. There is a "however"... the holes for the headlight buckets and lamp assemblies do take a little massaging to get perfect. They are a bit undersize for the buckets & housings to sit nice and flush to the body. Nothing that a carbide burr in the air die grinder didn't handle in a few seconds.

I did a little custom mod to the fuel filler. I wanted the unit to sit in the fender with the hinge at 11:00, latch at 5:00... but this puts the drain hole at about 11:00, on the high-side (nothing will drain!). I went as far as taking the unit apart to try and "reclock" it. No go, the hole never wound up at the low point. Ok, fine - drill another hole.
Here's the custom part. I didn't want any spilled gas just dribbling out inside the fender. I cut the nipple off of an 1/8" hose barb, threaded it 1/4-28, drill the proper hole in the filler and tapped it, and now I can put a length of hose on the filler and direct spills down & out.

I then took all the shiny bits back off the car, got it off the sawhorses & buck, and turtle'd it. The next several hours were spent working on the underside.

Per the advise of a few other builders, I just went pro-active and shaved off about 3/8" of the dash rolled lip, and about 1/4" off the rear cockpit lip. There's still plenty of rolled edge, and it should now just be a matter of sanding for clearance, not surgery.
I knocked all the boogers & stray strands down with some 80 grit, roughed everything up, vacuumed, and wiped it down with some acetone. The better part of a roll of tape, and on went the bedliner. I used the same stuff as the floorpans.
I masked off around any edge that will need attention during finish bodywork. I don't want the product reacting to body & paint products, or getting in the way/causing extra work the painter.

This is the 1st coat. It will get at least one more, probably two.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Couldn't help myself...
After unmasking the finish edges I enlisted Sheryl to help lift and set the body down over the chassis. It only weighs a bit over 100lbs., so it was do-able for the both of us.

I scored some 6mil poly sheet from a jobsite, and cut it into strips. The strips of poly cover the soft "bulb-seal" and strip foam padding that is applied to the panel edges & frame (where the body rests).
The foam is somewhat delicate, and reefing the body around to get it square/straight could tear it, so the poly gives it some "slippery" during this initial fitment phase.

The body plopped down over the frame with no fuss! It seems to be registering over the proper contact points... especially the door striker plates and the cockpit opening(s).
It's actually starting to look like a Roadster!

 



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Sooo, there are like 8 (eight) pieces to create the body shell?
Front and rear caps(2), hood surround(1), trunk surround(1), unisides (2), plus front and rear cockpit extensions (2)
Those are then bonded together to create the shell?
I am not seeing a seam in the door opening, so with the exception of the front and rear caps the whole side (uniside) is one piece, correct?

I am sure they thought the assembly out very well so there should be little problem with finish body work.
I would still try and find someone with lots of fiberglass experience.

Or just have it be your red rat rod!

tiphatthumbsup

Looking great!!!!

Karl



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This is the 4th-Gen body for the FFR Roadster (MkIV).

If you were to pull molds off of an original AC/Shelby/Cobra they'd be really close, but no cigar. FFR altered the rear 1/4's & rollpan to extend down further to conceal the fuel tank and blend the flares a bit nicer (those in the know call it the "perky butt" cars). And yes, there are 8 sections to the body... the seams aren't "Marine" quality by any means, but workable.

FFR claims that there should be no more than +/- 40 hours of bodywork needed before paint (by a pro experienced in fiberglass). Off the truck the doors are bolted to the hinges, and the hood & trunk are taped in the holes. The movable panels are molded separately, and trimmed with a generous overage for final gapping (they fit the openings, but barely).

I'm already in the queqe with a guy in Indiana... Jeff Kleiner. All's he does is FFR Roadsters, and he's been doing them for 20+ years - from the MkI's to the MkIv's. His quote/price is on par (if not a bit light) for a show quality job on a steel car that only needs some sweetening before paint. Here's some of his work:



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Glad you found someone with the knowledge and skills.
It is truly a "specialty" to make it primo!
After all your detail, the final product must match your efforts.

In junior high art class I made a clay model of a Cobra, thought they were cool then, my opinion has not changed.
Still have it, never fired it, wheels fell off, just dried out lump of clay now, but a fond memory.
Proved to myself I had no future as an artist of any kind.banghead
Karl



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Another few hours on #9365 today... installing the side louvers.
I'm kinda of mixed opinion/value here about having FFR cut these openings. Dimensionally they're good for the supplied "bend your own" louvers, but aren't quite nice for the aftermarket FinishLine/FFR upgrade louvers.
With the holes already cut in the body, you're held hostage as to making the upgrade louvers fit... and on one or two corners you're really cutting it close for a nice fit with enough reveal of the body edge. At best it's a cosmetic compromise. You fit the upgrade louvers to make the best of the already cut holes.

Without going into a "step by step", I traced the OD of the louver onto a piece of cardstock, cut it out on this line. Then took this template and made the best compromise of placement on the FFR cut out hole - all the while trying to maintain at least 1/8" to 3/16" of body material showing. (remember, my template was of the OD... there's 1/16" of aluminum, then the body edge). Using an air-recip saw and a Dremel w/ sanding drum I opened up the holes to fit my louvers.

I made my own perf'd screw-stud gizmos from some material I had around (hate paying for something I can make), and used some panel bonding adhesive to mount them to the fenders.
(Rather than riveting the "L" brackets to the louvers, I roughed up the "L's" and the louvers with 40g, and JB-Weld'd the "L's" to the louvers).

The adhesive I used has a 30 minute "open time", 2-hour "sand time" and after that you're screwed. Everything was dry-fitted before application of the glue.
I used a length of aluminum channel and some velcro strapping to hold the pieces in place during cure. I also had a piece of poly sheet between the "L" and the bracket to prevent any squeeze-out from sticking to the louver.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Looks like a good job of improvising on the louvers.

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Bruce L. - Lakeville MN

1971 Malibu Convert

1951 Pontiac Chieftain Super Deluxe Catalina Hardtop 



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40 Watt Garage - Body Fitment and Trim Out pt.1
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Some detail shots of the fuel filler mounted:

FuelCap03.jpg

FuelCap04.jpg

FuelCap05.jpg


There was a bit of trimming and some forming (basically creating a clearance bump around the fuel filler on the PS) for the rear inner fender splash panels ("elephant ears"), but they went in easily. Note the grommet and the fuel filler grounding attachment on the PS... There's a braided strap that grounds the filler neck - don't want to forget this!!

RWheelhouse01.jpg


The forward face of the rear wheelhouses has been a sore point with me. There's a large gap straight from the wheelhouse right into the "under door" area. Tons of crud and muck can get thrown into here! I totally understand why FFR doesn't supply a piece for this, as it'd be near impossible to pre-bend this piece with any chance of it fitting - the cars are too individual. I made my own.


I cut a piece of beer/pop case cardboard oversize, and taped the straight edge to the 3/4" tube that forms the kink in the rear cockpit wall. Using a spray bottle, I wetted down the cardboard to where it was pliable, and formed it into the space. A quick blast with the heat gun kinda "dryed" it into shape. I marked it with a Sharpie for a generous cut-line, and it was removed.
I've got a big sheet of 1/8" ABS plastic knocking around the shop (Thanks Larry!), and I thought "why not?". The template was cut on the lines, and flattened out on the ABS. A quick trace with a utility knife a few times, and the piece was snapped out of the sheet. (Repeat with the template flipped for the other side).
A little time with a sanding block to dress the edges and they were ready to fit.


I layed out equally spaced mounting holes and drilled them 3/16". There's really no curvature to the upper-most part of the piece, so I wiggled it in place and screwed it down - having 3 more screws and the screw-gun at the ready.
With the top anchored, I played over the piece with the heat gun. As it got pliable, I worked the straight edge against the 3/4" tube... not worrying about the rest of it, just the straight part on the tube. As it formed into place, screws were run into the steel tube. Let cool.
With the leftover 8" piece of 2" rubber fuel filler hose in-hand, I heated up the rest of the panel. As it got pliable, I used the rubber hose to roll/work it onto the contours of the fender. Just go slow & easy and let it heat and cool to stay in shape.
Total time for this was 1/2 hour per side.
RWheelF01.jpg

RWheelF02.jpg

RWheelF03.jpg

 


Fitting the trunk wasn't too bad. It's a LOT of back and forth playing with the hinges. I used a calipers to scribe a line around the trunk panel. The caliper was set to an "average" of the gap around the opening, being on the generous side of tight. I didn't want to remove too much material, just enough to get the panel to fit in the hole. It's a lot of sand, test, fit, sand, test fit.

Trunk01.jpg
Fitting the license light and latch assembly is straight forward, following the assembly manual and templates. I used a stiff piece of wire to snake the license light wires through the trunk lid, and a grommet where they broke out near the PS hinge.

More to come... door fitting and latches.



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - Trim Out pt.2
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SidePipes - I am using the FFR supplied stainless sidepipes.
There was zero chance of them fitting back on the header collectors using the FFR cut-outs on the body. As it turned out the cut-outs were OK fore & aft, but about 3/4" too short on the vertical.
Using the FFR template in the assembly manual, I basically just moved the upper radii & fore/aft line up about 1". Using a small air-powered recip saw I carefully cut on the inside of my new lines. Test fit the sidepipes. A little more here, a little more there, and then a final dressing with the Dremel and a sanding drum. I'll leave the final sweetening to Mr. Kleiner. (The driver's side looks good for "Parallelism", the passenger may need a wedge.)
Pipes01.jpg
Pipes02.jpg

Nose Trim/Mounting:
Do yourself a favor and order the rubber grommets from either Finishline or Metro Moulded. There's really no way to locate the nose of the car without them.
Again, I had FFR do the body cutouts, and the holes for the QuickJacks/Bumpers are spot-on. The nose of the car has to sit about 1/2" to 3/4" "proud" of the frame tubes near the hood hinges. Using the grommets in the holes, and lifting the body up revealed the FFR drilled holes were perfect.
FFR steel "eyebrows"... These things are so far off from working they almost became wall art. I spent a LOT of time altering the supplied holes to get them even in the neighborhood of lining up & fitting. Short story is that I welded on extra material off the side of one (mounting holes), and extended the mount holes on the other. Both sides needed the through-hole for the lamp assembly re-bored.
NoseTrim01.jpg

NoseTrim02.jpg

FWheelhouse02.jpg


Rollbar:
The FFR holes again were spot-on. Just a tiny bit of sweetening with the Dremel for a perfect fit with even gap all around. Give careful consideration about the mounting holes for the trim rings & grommets! Think about access from underneath, and from above with a screwdriver. I did have to grind/file/sand down the male stub on the hoop (for the outrigger) a bit so the outrigger would just slide up and slip onto the stub (the alignment wasn't quite perfect. It was close enough to twist it up and on and a thump with a rubber mallet would seat it, but you'd never get it off again.
RollBar.jpg



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage
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Several hours were spent on fitting the doors... I should say that the passenger door just about fell onto the car, and all the hours were on the driver's door!

I scribed a line around the opening on the doors, staying on the tight side. I want to leave as much material as possible for the bodyman/painter, but still have functional, non-sticking doors. A few times on & off with the passenger side, a few minutes monkeying with the hinges, and it was on. A really nice fit all around.

Enter the driver's door. What a PITA... and it's not just my car. I called my body-guy and he confirmed that every single MkIV he's done since they came out has had a crappy driver's door fit. He does a lot of rework on the door with 'glass & filler to get them right. His advise was to get it in the hole as best as you can, fit the latch, and he'll take it from there. So that's what I did.

(Once the car is back from paint and the doors are truly "final fitted" I'll remove the washer stack from the latch pin, and machine a aluminum spacer to the exact dimension).



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

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RE: Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage - Windshield
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I couldn't put it off any longer... that totally scary, delicately thin, HEAVY assembly had to go on the car. The big box has been sitting against the cabinets since day 1. I opened it to see if the glass was intact then sealed it up.

The other night I fitted the "side irons/bars" to the windshield frame. Driver's side just fell on - perfect fit. The passenger side was another story.
The curve at the top wasn't quite right. It had a bit of a twist in it, and the radius wasn't correct - it didn't lay down on the curve of the frame, and overhung aft a bit.

I wrapped it in tape, and using the plastic soft-jaws in the vise and a rubber mallet, proceeded to give it a few love taps/thumps. They're brass, and relatively soft, and if you don't go crazy on it there's no worries about cracking the plating. I was just chasing a 1/16th or so.

The side bars are attached to the frame with 5mm oval head machine screws, into a brass strip that's slide into a channel on the side of the frame. At best you'll get about 3 threads of engagement per screw, until they bottom out against the inner wall of the frame. Problem is the supplied screws are too long... they bottom out before the side bars are tight. This is where paying attention to the assembly manual (warnings), and having some "feel" is paramount. (There's about a post per week on FFR's site about "My windshield cracked when I screwed on the side bars!"... and the attached pics show dents on the inner frame. The glass is right behind there)
Windshield03.jpg


The side bars are too long out of the box. The consensus is to cut them off 13" down from the lowest mounting screw. This turned out to be a good starting point. 

A lot of time was spent back & forth enlarging the pre-cut slots in the body. Initially just to get the assembly to fit onto the car, then "sweetening" to ensure there was no body contact to the mounting bars when it was in the holes.

Windshield04.jpg

The recommended angle is achieved by measuring from the rear door opening to the top screw on the windshield. This distance is 27".
How are you supposed to hold opposite sides of a 30+ pound, fragile, flopping in the hole, 4 foot wide thing at a precise amount while trying to get it to fit!??
My Solution:

Windshield01.jpg

 

Windshield02.jpg

These are 1 meter long sticks of aluminum DIN rail (I use it daily to mount PLC's, relays, gizmo's in control cabinets). The channel shape makes it ideal, as they're rigid and won't "bow". A 3/16" hole was drilled 27" from the end, and a too-long 5mm screw threaded into the windshield frame as a locating stud.
With these in place I could (gently) jiggle the frame around and get it to set down on the body.

Again, a lot of back & forth, and on & off. I couldn't get the DS to set down quite right, and by feeling around the mounting holes I found the side-iron was bottomed on the frame tube - so another inch came off the end. It now snuggled down to the body.

The bars were marked through the nearly inaccessible chassis mounting holes, the whole assembly pulled, the bars removed, drilled and tapped for mounting bolts, and back on the car.

20190511_075109.jpg



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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread



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RE: Factory Five Mk4 Roadster Build - 40 Watt Garage
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Has it "snuck" around the block yet...stirpot



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Mitch D.   River Falls, WI

Charter member of the "Cars apart Club"

Some Assembly Required

1966 Chevelle SS 396 M20

1970 Chevelle SS 396 M20



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I can't confirm or deny the two, 10" wide black stripes on the hill up the curve from me..., but the integrity of the dash mounted "Jesus" grab handle is good (Sheryl tested it!)

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John D. - St. Louis Park, MN.

1965 El Camino - LT-1, 4L60e, 4wh discs, SC&C susp.
2013 F-150 Platinum - Twin Turbo 3.5

2018 Factory Five MkIV Roadster build thread

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